Golden Touch Craps
Post of the Month - June
This month there was a unanimous vote for Scan for POM for his post on "Dice Control..."
Dice control ...real?
"Scan" - 08:09am Jun 14, 2009 PT
August 07 Post of the Month !!!
DB-W in another posts brings up the question, is dice control is real? His (her?) post is not the usual Mr. Arnold, or whoever antagonistic spam post. He is questioning the math and the realities of the game. His question is valid. Being skeptical is a quality many people lack and he should be commended for raising questions.
The question is; Are there people that have an ability, albeit through practice or natural innate talent (rare), to control how the dice land.
Is this real or are all the magazine articles, the books the Internet message boards the members of the myriad dice control "camps" all just a bunch of deluded gamblers engaging in a virtual circle jerk thinking they found the holy grail of gambling. Can someone pick up two cubes toss them in the air, perhaps seven feet hit a wall covered in pyramids and have them land with two specific face up. .... The short answer is NO!
The long, and more controversial answer is ...Yes..... sort of..... To explore this we should first start with one premise. Lets say, in an experiment, we have a machine with a mechanical arm. It is designed to exacting standards and will swing in EXACTLY the same way at the same speed, with the same area of motion, utilizing same forward dynamic each time.
In the experiment diced are loaded into the machine in different "sets" Each set is tossed one million times. At the conclusion of the experiment the data is fed into a computer. We should all be able to agree the results would indicate clear OVERWHELMING patterns for each set.
OK are you still with me? I will say it again, I believe each dice set tossed the same way will result in a discernable patten. As you can see such a pattern, if repeatable, can be EASILY exploited to gain an advantage against a casino.
The problem is we are we are not machines and there are many factors at work in the real casino, so the "easy exploitation pattern" becomes a bit nebulous in the real world.
Bringing the laboratory to the casino is the challenge. The first hurdle is training yourself. The mechanical arm is designed to do the same exact thing over and over. You as the shooter must be able to constantly and consistently toss the dice over and over again. Sound easy, but repeating the same motion is very difficult. To do this you must then practice, practice, practice and practice some more.
In the practice session the results of the toss is secondary to the quest for consistency. When you get to the point in which you can do the same thing each time. You have reached the first level. That is it this is just the first step, sorry to disappoint you. It is however a very big step. Congratulations!
Next you have to practice, practice and practice some more.... the difference is, this time you ,will be recording your result for future analysis. If you survive this without losing interest or your arm falling off, you will discern your patterns. You are now ready to TRY this out in the casino.
When you walk into the caino the first thing you realize is this is a lot different from your den. There it is quiet, perhaps you had Sinatra or Dean playing in the background when you practiced. Here it is noisy. There are many distraction. Cocktail waitreses... people coming and going.... winners cheering and losers cursing.
You step up to the table with a bunch of other players. You are lucky you are able to get the spot you practice from at home. You place your hard earned cash on the felt and it is exchanged for chips. When the dice come to you your hands are sweating. You are wondering if the casino boss is going to toss you out when he see your throw. You pick up the dice, fumble to set them and promptly point seven out.
A few more times around the table your bankroll is up and down. You are feeling more comfortable as time goes by.As you relax you are starting to have more confidence. You remember the patterns the endless hours of practice revealed. You are eschewing all bets that do not fall within your pattern. Things are starting to happen..... you are having longer rolls ......you are starting to like this stuff.
In the weeks and months ahead you continue to practice. You have good and bad days.
You are an educated player, you do not want to gamble with money needed for your home and family. You have a strict rule of only risking money form your "401G" or the little known "offshore 401G". You are on the way to becoming a threat to the casino... a minor one... as your edge even in the best of circumstances is small.. but you are no longer just a sucker hoping to catch lightening in a bottle.
So getting back to the question can someone "CONTROL" each roll of the dice... I have never seen it... Plus I am not aware of any legitimate person that makes that claim. Can "SOME" people influence the dice and exploit that against the casino...... Yes ..in my opinion.
Believe me the numbers are small... SO we have to be prudent in investing our cash expecting a positve EV. Just a week ago... I felt like the biggest dope in the world because I dumped a nice Pai Gow winning.
So getting back to the question can someone exactly "control" EACH roll of the dice... I have never seen it... Plus I am not aware of any legitimate person that makes that claim. Can "SOME" people "influence" the dice and exploit that against the casino.......... yes.
Believe me the numbers are small... Just look at this board. There are thousands of members.... but maybe a hundred or so steady posters. How many people have we seen come and go through the years. Many come on strong and burn out quickly.... So we have to be prudent in investing our cash expecting a positve EV.
We also have to be realistic. A few year back, before this board even existed.. some of us old timers shared info on different sites including re.gambling.craps (now a spam filled mess) . On one of the board there was a guy that worked as, I think an. I.T. guy in a casino. He was new to this but he was gung ho to say the least. He was planning to quit his job and support his wife and two children with dice control. I posted a diatribe blasting his plan and explaining the realities of "this thing of ours"
I made a few enemies of the other posters that were encouraging him, but I felt I had to open his eyes to the real world. This is a great hobby or "CRAFT" as I call it. It is not the way to feed your family.
Last word on this...... the road of "dice Influencing" is filled with potholes. There is temptations to make high house advantage bets, errors in judgement and just bad luck all around. Just a week ago... I felt like the biggest dope in the world because I dumped a nice Pai Gow winning and more back to the casino after thinking I identified a good shooter. It turned out this ersatz dice controller was just a random roller that read an article or something. His initial throws were luck. When I placed my money down his toss when in the toilet. I then started dumping chips on others and myself in order to "get back" my money. I wrote about it here. In that case I broke every rule in the book... the results were predictable... anyway it was a lesson learned for me
The above is my OPINION..your experiences may differ.
Post of Distinction
There was also a very strong feeling for DavidM's (Pitchman) post of "Mr. LoRiggio...Pain" for the POD.
